Whisker Biscuit and Arrow Velocity

[Gator]

Just a note on the W.B.

If you have spent any time on this or any other forum in the last year or so you will be familiar with the popularity of the Whisker Bisket. The number of people that like or dis-like them seems to be fairly evenly divided.

No doubt those that like the WB, like how easy it is to set up and how quickly they are able to get good arrow flight.
Many like the full containment feature of the rest and the fact that they are not likely to have their arrow fall off from their rest at the moment of truth and they are willing to sacrifice some arrow launch velocity to have this feature.

On the other hand the more experienced archers seem to gravitate toward rests that do not tend to reduce the launch velocity of their arrows when their bows are properly tuned.

We recently did some testing designed to determine how much the WB affected
Arrow launch velocity and found that there were a number of factors that had an influence on the arrows launch velocity when the WB was used.

The WB tested had arrow entry in the 4th. quadrant and was composed of two different bristle colors. The bristles that supported the arrow on the sides and above were brown in color and measured about .008” in dia. The bristles that supported the bottom portion of the arrow were black in color and measured about .010” in diameter.
The circular opening in the center of the WB measured .314” in diameter ( a .315” dia gage pin would not slide through the opening under its own weight.)

The chronograph used to measure arrow velocities was capable of measuring the launch velocities of the arrows tested to less than 0.25 fps accuracy, verifiably.

We shot a number of different diameter arrows and we shot arrows having different types of fletching. The idea was to determine what effect arrow shaft friction played in reducing the arrows launch velocity and also to what extent did the arrows fletching contribute to the loss in launch velocity.

The bow that was used in the test was machine shot from exactly the same draw length for each shot and the nocking point travel was straight line in both the horizontal and vertical planes which should have minimized the force variations exerted on the O.D. of the shaft during launch. ( ie: the bow was well tuned)

All of the fletched arrows that were shot were fletched straight offset and the fletching was oriented such that each of the three fletch passed thru the brown bristles.

Conclusions:
1. When the arrow shaft diameter is only slightly larger than the W.B. opening, the velocity loss was 3fps of which a little over 1fps was due to shaft friction.
2. When the arrow shaft diameter is .015 to .020” less than the W.B. opening the velocity loss was about 2fps. With the 3” vanes showing slightly less loss than the 4” vanes. (less than .5fps) and the 5” feathers being in between the two.
3. The velocity loss is proportional to the degree that the arrow shaft is larger than the natural opening size of the W.B. There was a velocity loss if 4.6 fps when the shaft was about .085” larger, resulting in loss due to shaft friction being almost triple that of an arrow properly sized for the W.B.

I have seen some posts on this forum where people have attributed as much as 5fps or more velocity loss to the W.B. and I can see from our testing that such values could be possible. Especially if one considers the possible combination of a larger diameter shaft, 5” helical fletched vanes and a poorly tuned bow or a bow having less than desirable nocking point travel.

Just thought that I would pass this on for what ever it might be worth.

[vince71969]

You guys have the coolest toys

[Tropicalfruitmom]

vince71969 wrote:

You guys have the coolest toys

I want to come play in your toyshop!

Thanks for the info. Yet another reason not to use a WB.
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Ava
Hey, It's only my opinion!

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[Indychris]

Awesome test, Gators! Thanks for helping to keep us on top of all things archery!
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[IowaSwitchback]

Tropicalfruitmom wrote:

vince71969 wrote: You guys have the coolest toys I want to come play in your toyshop! Thanks for the info. Yet another reason not to use a WB.

With only losing that much speed How could you not use it?
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Switchback...Reezen 7 Camo..Black Reezen 6.5
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[Symo]

The real intent of this post was so you could make an informed decision about whether you want to use one or not, not to imply that you should or should not use one. Some may see the amount of reduction as too much, while others may think that the loss is nothing compared to the benefits gained. We've already seen these two views in the responses so far.
_________________
Jon Simonds, M.E.
Engineering Staff, Research & Development
Mathews Inc.

[jeronimo]

very intersting results . i would have thought there would been a greater loss of speed from friction. thanks for posting that jon

[Jeff K in IL]

Wow, I need to spend time with Jon, he will teach me all I need to know...

Interesting report as well..
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Mathews Prestige
Gold Tip XT Hunters
Flex Fletch FFP-360
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[thunderchicken21]

Very interesting Thanks for the great report
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Thunderchicken Cam's....come getcha some

[IRONMAIDEN]

very interesting! thanks i have to wonder though if there was no fletch contact at all , like duck29's trimmed WB..i'll cut one up and send it to ya?

[tbolden]

Thanks for the info. You guys make it well worth the time spent here. Plus the fact that you just tell it like it is and let everyone make there own decisions.
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Maxima Arrows
Foxfire Sight
WB

[Chiller]

Great info!
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[KILL EM ALL]

thanks for the info
I want to come over and play 2
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[bowtie1201]

great info...thought it would take more speed away than that....
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[Arquero]

One factor you may have left out is also bow torque. My wife was shooting the WB and I noticed she was grabbing the bow right at the shot and she would get erratic arrow flight. I took off the WB and installed a drop away rest and her groups tightened up immediately. She also picked up about 5 fps. I know there is no substitution for good form but I'd still like to have the most forgiving set up I can get my hands on.

[Nippers]

Thanks for the info. I wonder if stiffer vanes like the Blazers would also make a difference?
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and way too many toys to go along

[PETERSONRJ]

Thank you. You just saved me some money I was going to buy a dropaway

[Jameson]

thanks for the test i would say after all the WB isnt really a bad rest i can handle 5fps loss...

[L.O.S.T.Arrow]

AHHHHHHHH -you guys ruined all my fun--I kinna enjoyed the weekly "WB SMACKDOWN"

Awesome post- - thanks for that---some things I have been telling deaf ears for years -

-I also BET that all the arrows shot from the machine hit the exact hole each time -

The WB is an excellent tool for the K.I.S.S. [Keeep It Simple Stupid] crowd like myself- and I [or/and most veteran shooters] can consistently shot in the 280 290's Vegas FITA rounds utilising the WB.

I would also bet that IF...the taken the WB and any Drop Away--shoot them via shooting Machine that after a couple of hundred or so shots that the WB would be more consistent in hole punching and tend to move less on impact due to string/cable "Settlement", wear and bow rest components moving.

I have been in a few "situations" in hunting adventures where even only a handful of veterans could keep an arrow on a drop away or launcher type rest---bear attack ,- elk slamming willow bush I was hiding behind knocking me, bow, and arrow in several direction s, etc.

I’m not knocking the beloved drop aways and/or shooters --Im just an avid WB fan and my 100's of shooters that walk out of my shop wear one on their bow--for all reasons mention above--[all hunter class].

JMO-- I WB

Oh and IRONMAIDEN -interesting concept hmmm

Neil
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[VAbowhunter]

Do you have to shoot fletch down on a WB
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[jrmsoccer32]

no you actually shoot odd fletch up because the brown whiskers are not as stiff and arent as rough on the fletchings

[aw drenaline]

Thanks for the info. I was thinking of trying both the (WB and the drop away just to get my own experience but I don't think I need to now. My arrow shafts are slightly smaller than the WB so I'm A ok. Great findings thanks a mill.

[808XT]

Nippers wrote:

Thanks for the info. I wonder if stiffer vanes like the Blazers would also make a difference?

I was wondering the same thing. Since the Blazers are also a higher profile vane in addition to being stiffer, would that have any (measureable) effect on performance of the WB?
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[FullDraw]

I've been thinking of switching to a WB. I shoot blazers and have spoken with several experienced archery pro's in the area regarding the WB and vane damage. All have told me that the damage is very minimal, if any, with the blazer vanes. All shoot a WB and have their arrows with the blazer wraps and vanes and all shoot everyday. The only thing they added was a little drop of fletch-tight at the tip of every vane. No problems.

[greg waldron]

this is a 1st class post and great information thanks for keeping us consumers informed